Yuri Besmenov: A Prophet from the Soviet Union : 1984

Yuri Bezmenov was a member of the elite propaganda arm of the KGB, known as the Novasti Press Agency. This interview, was conducted by G. Edward Griffin, in 1984 about the four stages of subversion: “Oh, yes. I’m trying to tell you that it has to be stopped unless you want to end up in the Gulag system and enjoy all the advantages of socialist equality: working for free, catching fleas on your body, sleeping on the planks of plywood — in Alaska this time, I guess — that’s where Americans will belong. Unless they will wake up….”

     “…Just sit down, look at your navel and meditate. And things, due to some strange logic, due to cosmic vibration, will settle down by themselves. This is exactly what the KGB and Marxist–Leninist propaganda wants from Americans: to distract their opinion, attention, and mental energy from real issues of United States into non-issues, into a non-world, non-existent harmony. Obviously, it’s more beneficial for the Soviet (China today, with reverse opium war) aggressors to have a bunch of duped Americans than Americans who are self-conscious, healthy, physically fit, and alert to reality…” Ideological subversion is the process which is legitimate, overt, and open. You can see it with your own eyes… But in reality, the main emphasis of the KGB is not in the area of intelligence at all. According to my opinion, and the opinion of many defectors of my caliber, only about 15 percent of time, money and manpower is spent on espionage as such. The other 85 percent is a slow process, which we call either ideological subversion or “active measures” — aktivnye meropriyatiya in the language of the KGB — or psychological warfare. What it basically means is, to change the perception of reality of every American to such an extent that despite the abundance of information, no one is able to come to sensible conclusions in the interests of defending themselves, their families, their community, and their country. It’s a great brainwashing process which goes very slow, and it’s divided into four basic stages, the first one being demoralization. It takes from fifteen to twenty years to demoralize a nation. Why that many years? Because this is the minimum number of years required to educate one generation of students in the country of your enemy. Exposed to the ideology of the enemy. In other words, Marxism–Leninism ideology is being pumped into the soft heads of at least three generations of American students without being challenged or counterbalanced by the basic values of Americanism, American patriotism. The result, the result you can see. Most of the people who graduated in the ’60s, drop-outs or half-baked intellectuals, are now occupying the positions of power in the government, civil service, business, mass media, educational system. You are stuck with them. You cannot get rid of them. They are contaminated. They are programmed to think and react to certain stimuli in a certain pattern. You cannot change their minds. Even if you expose them to authentic information, even if you prove that white is white and black is black, you still cannot change the basic perception and the logic of behavior. In other words, these people — the process of demoralization is complete and irreversible. To rid society of these people you need another twenty years to educate a new generation of patriotically-minded, common-sense people who would be acting in favor and in the interests of the United States society…Most of them, yes. Simply because the psychological shock when they see in the future what the beautiful society of equality and social justice means in practice, obviously they will revolt.    They will be very unhappy, frustrated people. And the Marxist–Leninist regime does not tolerate these people. They obviously they will join the ranks of dissenters, dissidents. Unlike in the present

United States, there will be no place for dissent in future Marxist–Leninist America…”  

    “In the future, these people will be simply squashed like cockroaches. Nobody is going to pay them nothing for their beautiful, noble ideas of equality. This they don’t understand and it will be a great shock for them, of course. The demoralization process in the United States is basically completed already. For the last twenty-five years — actually, it’s over-fulfilled because demoralization now reaches such areas where previously not even Comrade Andropov and all his experts would even dream of such a tremendous success. Most of it is done by Americans to Americans, thanks to a lack of moral standards. As I mentioned before, exposure to true information does not matter anymore. A person who is demoralized is unable to assess true information. The facts tell nothing to him. Even if I shower him with information, with authentic proof, with documents, with pictures…he will refuse to believe it — until he is going to receive a kick in his fat bottom. When the military boot crushes his balls, then he will understand — but not before that. That is the tragedy of the situation of demoralization. So basically, America is stuck with demoralization. And even if you start right now, here, this minute, you start educating a new generation of Americans. It will still take you fifteen to twenty years to turn the tide of ideological perception of reality back to normalcy and patriotism. The next stage is destabilization. This time the subverter does not care about your ideas and the patterns of your consumption. Whether you eat junk food and get fat and flabby, doesn’t matter anymore. This time, and it takes only from two to five years to destabilize a nation, what matters is essentials: economy, foreign relations, and defense systems. And you can see quite clearly that in some areas, in such sensitive areas as defense and economy, the influence of Marxist–Leninist ideas in the United States is absolutely fantastic. I could never believe it fourteen years ago when I landed in this part of the world that the progress would go that fast. The next stage, of course, is crisis. It may take only up to six weeks to bring a country to the verge of crisis…And after crisis, with a violent change of power, structure, and economy, you have the so-called period of normalization. It may last indefinitely. Normalization is a cynical expression borrowed from Soviet propaganda. When the Soviet tanks moved into Czechoslovakia in ‘68, Comrade Brezhnev said, “Now the situation in brotherly Czechoslovakia is normalized.” This is what will happen in the United States if you allow all these schmucks to bring the country to crisis, to promise people all kinds of goodies and the paradise on Earth, to destabilize your economy, to eliminate the principle of free market competition, and to put a Big Brother government in Washington, D.C…Never mind. They will create false illusions that the situation is under control. The situation is not under control, the situation is disgustingly out of control. Most of the American politicians, media, and educational system train another generation of people who think they are living in peace time. False. The United States is in the state of war — undeclared, total war against the basic principles and the foundations of this system. And the initiator of this war is not Comrade Andropov, of course. It’s the system, however ridiculous it may sound. The world communist system or the world communist conspiracy. Whether I scare some people or not, I don’t give a hoot. If you are not scared by now, nothing can scare you. But you don’t have to be paranoid about it….Unlike myself, you have literally several years to live on unless the United States wakes up. The time bomb is ticking. With every second, the disaster is coming closer and closer. Unlike myself, you will have nowhere to defect to…This is it. This is the last country of freedom and possibility…”

…Well, the immediate thing that comes to my mind is, of course, there must be a very strong national effort to educate people in the spirit of real patriotism, number one. Number two, to explain to them, the real danger of socialist, communist — whatever — welfare state, big brother government. If people fail to grasp the impending danger of that development, nothing ever can help the United States. You may kiss goodbye to your freedom, including freedoms to homosexuals, to prison inmates — all this freedom will vanish, evaporate in five seconds. Including your precious lives. The second thing… At the moment, at least part of the United States population is convinced that the danger is real. They have to force their government — and I’m not talking about sending letters, signing petitions, and all this beautiful, noble activity — I am talking about forcing the United States government to stop aiding communism because there is no other problem more burning and urgent than to stop the Soviet military–industrial complex from destroying whatever is left of the free world. And it is very easy to do. No credits, no technology, no money, no political or diplomatic recognition. And of course, no such idiocy as grain deals to USSR. The Soviet people, 270 millions of Soviets, will be eternally thankful to you if you stop aiding a bunch of murderers who sit now in the Kremlin and whom President Reagan respectfully calls “government.” They do not govern anything, least of all such complexity as the Soviet economy. So basic… Two very simple — maybe too simplistic answers or solutions — but nevertheless they are the only solutions. Educate yourself, understand what is going on around you. You are not living in a time of peace. You are in a state of war and you have precious little time to save yourself. You don’t have much time, especially if you are talking about young generation. There is not much time left for convulsions and sexual masturbation to the beautiful disco music. Very soon it will go, just overnight. If we are talking about capitalists or wealthy businessmen, I think they are selling the rope on which they will hang very soon. If they don’t stop it — they cannot curb their insatiable desire for profit — and if they keep on trading with the monster of Soviet (Chinese) communism, they are going to hang very soon. And they will pray to be killed. But unfortunately they will be sent to Alaska, probably to manage an industry of slaves. It’s simplistic. I know it sounds unpleasant. I know Americans don’t like to listen to things which are unpleasant, but I have defected not to tell you the stories about such idiocy as microfilm James Bond-type espionage. This is garbage. You don’t need any espionage anymore. I have come to talk about survival. It’s a question of survival of this system. You may ask me, what is in it for me. Survival, obviously. Because as I said, I am now in your boat. If we sing together, we’ll sing beautifully together. There is no other place on this planet to defect to.

Wake up: the Revolution is happening now!

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